# SENS, Aubrey de Grey, and Harassment
**URL:** https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261
**Category:** Other
**Tags:** social-dynamics
**Created:** [August 11, 2021, 5:58pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261 "2021-08-11T17:58:15Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 5
### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 8:52pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/81 "2021-09-11T20:52:01Z")
The two emails saying “hotter than hell” were re Laura – AdG tried again after Laura didn’t take the bait the first time. I’m reading the report now:
[https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf](https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf)
> - Did Dr. de Grey send Complainant #1 emails of a sexual nature on April 16, 2012 and May 11, 2012 when she was 17 and 18 years old, and with the purpose of developing a romantic and/or sexual relationship with her? – Yes, Sustained.
Also looks like they aren’t reporting about any other women yet, so the email about using all assets to get donors has gotta be Celine stuff.
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 8:52pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/82 "2021-09-11T20:52:44Z")
> **[r/longevity - SRF investigation of Aubrey de Grey completed](https://www.reddit.com/r/longevity/comments/plw0bl/srf_investigation_of_aubrey_de_grey_completed/)**
>
> 65 votes and 43 comments so far on Reddit
Lots of people still defending AdG or saying that his interference with the investigation was the only major problem but the actual allegations were no big deal.
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### Author:  [@JustinCEO](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/JustinCEO)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 8:56pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/83 "2021-09-11T20:56:06Z")
> [@Elliot](#):
>
> I read email 5 as him telling Celine, in writing, that he really does want her to charm and sleep with donors.
jfc
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 8:57pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/84 "2021-09-11T20:57:00Z")
Read some awful reddit comments and one actual good one:
> I just finished reading the [Executive Summary report](https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf).
>
> I noticed a few typos on page 14 of 16 (actual page 16 of 18 of PDF):
>
> - There are three dates mentioned on this page - "July 2, **2019**", "July 6, **2019**", and "July 6, **2019**".
>
> I think these should be 2021 and not 2019.
>
> I am surprised that multiple people that read this report (before it was published) missed it!
I didn’t actually double check these points but I’m guessing he’s right.
The world is full of scholarship errors.
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### Author:  [@Apricus](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Apricus)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 8:59pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/85 "2021-09-11T20:59:51Z")
Just finished reading the executive summary myself… Looks really bad in terms of what Aubrey did. He showed a pattern of objectifying these women and treating them sexually, and thinking that it’s basically OK because a) they should do whatever it takes to win the war against aging, comparing it to women sleeping with Nazis for info during WW2 and b) he could treat the younger woman as an equal in every way except sexually until she turned 17-18, which was “jarring” (ugh) for him.
It’s fine if he’s sexually liberated or whatever but he doesn’t get to harass people and expect them to have the same attitude as he does about that stuff…
Since he’s already been fired from SENS, is there anything else they can really do to? Since Aubrey has threatened to start up his own anti-aging thing again, I wonder if he will actually do that. I was wondering at the time if he was partly bluffing since he seemed to put so much effort into staying with SENS.
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:04pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/86 "2021-09-11T21:04:41Z")
AdG knew Laura since she was 12. Not sure where I got 14.
[https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf](https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf)
> Leading up to these emails, Dr. de Grey had been an informal mentor to Complainant #1 since she moved to the United States in 2006 when she was age 12.
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:08pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/87 "2021-09-11T21:08:27Z")
[https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf](https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf)
> Dr. de Grey acknowledged writing and sending both emails to Complainant #1 [Laura Deming]. In both his interviews, and in public social medial posts, Dr. de Grey stated he “unreservedly” regretted sending Complainant #1 the April 16, 2012 email. However, Dr. de Grey denied he sent the emails with any improper motive. During his interview, he further asserted he inserted a smiley emoji to ensure she would not take offense:
>
> > I have to appeal to my ignorance of American ways. I was new [to America] then. I can immediately see in my 2021 self I should not have written “resisted temptation,” even though I put a smiley at the end. I thought that was ample to ensure nobody – especially someone I knew well – would take offense. Today I would never write anything like that.”
>
> As for the May 11, 2012 “hotter than hell” email, Dr. de Grey said in his interview: “I am not exactly so ashamed of the ‘hotter than hell’ comment – that is just British.”
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### Author:  [@JustinCEO](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/JustinCEO)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:10pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/88 "2021-09-11T21:10:27Z")
From the report:
> However, Dr. de Grey denied he sent the emails with any improper motive. During his interview, he further asserted he inserted a smiley emoji to ensure she would not take offense:
oh come on!
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:15pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/89 "2021-09-11T21:15:00Z")
[https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf](https://www.sens.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/SENS-Executive-Summary-For-Public-Release-FINAL-091021-00323152xC0E95.pdf)
> During Complainant #2’s studies at Oxford, Dr. de Grey attended a conference followed by a formal dinner. Complainant #2 said Dr. de Grey was seated to her right during the dinner, at a long table hosting about 20 people. Complainant #2 said she was asked by a then-SRF executive to sit by Dr. de Grey at the dinner. She believed she was asked with the intent that, by being seated next to an attractive woman, Dr. de Grey would not leave early. Complainant #2 said that evening Dr. de Grey called her a “glorious woman,” and then suggested she should use her “womanhood” or her “womanly powers” to get donors to give SRF money. She recalled he said words to the effect of “glorious women like you have a responsibility,” either stating or implying she should “have sex with donors to fund him more.”
Also the dinner was in 2017. The email saying to charm and screw donors was 2014. The report says it was to a different young woman.
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:16pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/90 "2021-09-11T21:16:32Z")
> In his July 14, 2021 investigative interview, Dr. de Grey stated he solicited her in that conversation to join the “crusade” of defeating aging by “using all the weapons we have, including weapons that are not just intellectual.” Dr. de Grey explained this was an “encouragement of her to use her femininity.” He acknowledged the woman was “unimpressed” by his comments.
then he sent her the email he apparently thought would persuade her.
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:17pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/91 "2021-09-11T21:17:36Z")
> Dr. de Grey explained the woman’s negative reaction served as a “complete recalibration” for him regarding the way he approached women. Dr. de Grey said that since then, he “has never said anything near to that any time after or beforehand either.” He said:
>
> > It is just not possible I could have said anything like this to [Complainant #2] in 2018. […] I would not dream of saying anything remotely along those lines. I have not used any of my staff in terms of womanhood in that way. I put my scientists next to donors to talk science.
He claims he learned his lesson from the one incident.
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### Author:  [@JustinCEO](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/JustinCEO)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:17pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/92 "2021-09-11T21:17:59Z")
The notes seem to indicate that Attachment 5 was an email sent to someone that was not one of the complainants?
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### Author:  [@JustinCEO](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/JustinCEO)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:18pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/93 "2021-09-11T21:18:33Z")
moreover, it says that they interviewed that woman, and she thinks she didn’t have access to the email account that email was sent from…so did AUBREY share that?!
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### Author:  [@Apricus](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Apricus)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:18pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/94 "2021-09-11T21:18:35Z")
@JustinCEO re: the smiley face thing…
> > However, Dr. de Grey denied he sent the emails with any improper motive. During his interview, he further asserted he inserted a smiley emoji to ensure she would not take offense:
> oh come on!
He keeps seeming to think that he can get away with inane statements if he just says he was joking afterwards:
> At one point [Dr. de Grey] told me to ‘encourage [a research associate] to get close to
> this donor so he would give us more money.’ I told him it was incredibly inappropriate
> and not to bring that up. He laughed and said, ‘Just joking.’ To the best of my
> knowledge, he did not say that to [the research associate].”26
This is like that meme going around where people will do/say something ridiculous or harmful and then say, “It’s just a prank, bro”
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:18pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/95 "2021-09-11T21:18:39Z")
> Dr. de Grey believes Complainant #2 somehow learned about his comment to this woman, and reattributed it to Complainant #2. (Investigator’s Note: The recipient of this email, whom we interviewed, believed it was an “impossibility” either Complainant #1 or #2 knew of Dr. de Grey’s comment or email to her. She stated she did not share this information, nor did she know Complainant #2. Further, the recipient stated she personally had no recollection of this email, noting it was “90 percent likely” she did not even read Dr. de Grey’s email.)25
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### Author:  [@JustinCEO](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/JustinCEO)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:19pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/96 "2021-09-11T21:19:37Z")
“haha chill brah you’re hot as hell and should put out for donors jk jk ;D”
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### Author:  [@Elliot](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Elliot)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:19pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/97 "2021-09-11T21:19:40Z")
> Dr. de Grey said that although he would not have made this statement to Complainant #2, he does, in fact, believe those in the aging industry need to use whatever means necessary to fight the war on aging. During my interview with Dr. de Grey on July 14, 2021, he explained:
>
> > That is what I thought. It is at the same level of women in World War II sleeping with Nazis to get information. It is a war against aging here. You have to persuade people to give money. That is honestly who I am. I am the general.
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### Author:  [@Apricus](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Apricus)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:20pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/98 "2021-09-11T21:20:43Z")
> moreover, it says that they interviewed that woman, and she thinks she didn’t have access to the email account that email was sent from…so did AUBREY share that?!
If he sent it from his sens email (which he seemed to have used for all manner of personal things) then maybe they got it when looking at those logs? not sure though. Will check if the report explains how they got this email.
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### Author:  [@Apricus](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Apricus)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:21pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/99 "2021-09-11T21:21:39Z")
So he claims he learned his lesson from the one incident but then sends a documented email years later making the same mistake? Weird…
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### Author:  [@Apricus](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/u/Apricus)
#### Post date: [September 11, 2021, 9:24pm UTC](https://discuss.criticalfallibilism.com/t/sens-aubrey-de-grey-and-harassment/261/100 "2021-09-11T21:24:14Z")
> Dr. de Grey said that although he would not have made this statement to Complainant #2, he does, in fact, believe those in the aging industry need to use whatever means necessary to fight the war on aging. During my interview with Dr. de Grey on July 14, 2021, he explained:
>
> > That is what I thought. It is at the same level of women in World War II sleeping with Nazis to get information. It is a war against aging here. You have to persuade people to give money. That is honestly who I am. I am the general.
Just wondering if Aubrey is willing to have sex with rich, old men to further fund SENS, since he’s comparing this in importance to gathering info from the Nazis in World War II. He says he’s glad to use whatever capabilities he has if it will further the cause…
Edit: My guess is he will say he has better things to do with his time and energy since he is the “general” and not a foot soldier. 🤦♂️
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